Aa history Lovers 2004 moderators Nancy Olson and Glenn F. Chesnut page
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to be perfectly acceptable for reading in meetings by any other A.A. groups in the world. That seemed to have been the key: if that pamphlet or little book been sponsored by an A.A. group somewhere then it was perfectly O.K. for other A.A. groups to use. In early A.A. the New York office took this position too: something that is written and printed by the members of one A.A. group is totally legitimate to read in A.A. meetings anywhere else. Dr. Bob and Bill W. both put themselves on record as supporting that principle. Jack H. in Scottsdale, Arizona, has a copy of The Little Red Book which Dr. Bob had personally made notes on, making suggestions to Ed Webster for changes or additions to be made in the next edition. It is obvious that Dr. Bob gave his O.K. to the four Akron pamphlets also. Bill W. wrote to Ed Webster in November 1950 and said "we are not policemen" here at the New York headquarters, "AAs are free to read any book they choose." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Usually in early A.A. (though not necessarily, since each A.A. group is completely autonomous and can read anything it wants to) books and pamphlets which were not sponsored by a particular A.A. group were only read outside of formal A.A. meetings. In early A.A. in South Bend, Indiana, for example, little groups would gather in people's homes to read and talk about the latest Golden Book, but they would not call these "A.A. meetings" in the formal sense. They were just little private groups of A.A. members gathering on their own. The Golden Books were printed and distributed by Ralph Pfau (Father John Doe) on his own. They had marked on the title page that they were published by the "SMT Guild," which meant the "Society of Matt Talbott," which in turn meant Father Ralph himself and the three nuns who served as his secretaries and helpers in the convent in Indianapolis where he lived as confessor to the sisters. Ralph got along O.K. with the A.A. groups in Indianapolis where he was based, but none of the Indianapolis groups officially sponsored these Golden Books, and he basically had to do that on his own. Likewise, the books on the early Akron A.A. recommended reading list (Emmet Fox's Sermon on the Mount, James Allen's As a Man Thinketh, Henry Drummond's The Greatest Thing in the World, Ernest Ligon's Psychology of Christian Personality, and so on) were not usually, to the best of my knowledge, read from or used for providing meeting topics in formal A.A. meetings. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ On the other hand, A.A. groups all around the country had books which were on this Akron list for sale for A.A. members to purchase. Mel B. (sober 1950) bought two books from this list in Detroit A.A. when he was first getting sober. When I asked Brooklyn Bob here in South Bend whether there was any rule in early A.A. about "only reading conference-approved literature," he snorted and laughed and said, "We read anything we could get our hands on that might get us sober!" Real early A.A. was like that, intensely pragmatic -- these were not rule-bound uptight people who thought that you could get people sober by repeating mechanical formula phrases and preventing the members from ever reading or hearing anything that was not approved by the tiny circle of people who led the organization -- all the really good old-timers whom I have interviewed have had that same kind of marvelously free and flexible spirit as Brooklyn Bob had, they're just wonderful people. So if A.A. people who had some sobriety under their belts in various parts of the country said, "Yeah, that book by Emmet Fox, The Sermon on the Mount, sure helped me and some of our other members when we first came in -- it doesn't work for everybody, you know, but for some of us it really opened our eyes as to what we were supposed to be doing when we were working the steps" -- then A.A. people in other parts of the country would read it and see if it helped them. And if it helped enough people there, then it would be made available for sale at their A.A. group or their intergroup office, and newcomers would be encouraged to read it if it seemed appropriate to that particular person's central problems. And contrariwise, I remember when one of John Bradshaw's later books was literally driving some susceptible people over the edge into full-fledged psychosis, where their attempts to use his methods to come into contact with their "Inner Child" did so much psychological damage that they had to be institutionalized for several years afterwards. I'm not kidding, they were genuinely and literally driven insane by the traumatic stuff that started coming out of their subconscious minds. It was only a few people who were driven literally insane in this way, but the word nevertheless spread through responsible A.A. circles in my part of northern Indiana: Do NOT give that book to newcomers, or anybody else, it's too dangerous. Do NOT sell that book at the intergroup offices. WARN people who start talking about reading that book about how dangerous it is. We can't play games like that with people's lives. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ But the idea which sprang up in the late 1980's and early 1990's, that somehow or other it wasn't "proper" for an A.A. group or intergroup to sell helpful books that weren't published by Alcoholics Anonymous World Services in New York is another thing that is threatening to cut A.A. off from its historical roots. The New York office never ever had the money to publish all the useful books that could help a recovering alcoholic, and still doesn't today. The traditions forbid A.A. itself from having the kind of wealthy publishing houses that some of the larger religious denominations have (Abingdon Press, Fortress Press, Augsburg Press, Westminster Press, Loyola University Press, Ave Maria Press, and so on, for the Methodists, Lutherans, Roman Catholics, and the other large church organizations). Therefore we MUST to a certain extent rely on individuals to publish some of the literature which A.A. needs in order to be successful. The important thing is to make it clear at all times that several people who get together to publish some books on A.A. cannot claim any official A.A. connection in anything that shows up in public, even if all of them are A.A. members. Likewise, an A.A. group itself cannot get involved in the enormous monetary expense of publishing a full sized book -- this can sometimes require thousands of dollars for the initial investment. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Also, just for myself, I would prefer that A.A. books of this sort be published on a totally nonprofit basis if at all possible, just as Richmond Walker did when he was printing and distributing his Twenty-Four Hour book. I have a rule for myself that I will not be involved in publication ventures involving any kind of program-related material, unless the group publishing it is a genuine nonprofit organization which exists only to help alcoholics. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ At any rate, Linda, I hope that some of these materials may give you some useful ideas. Having a set of Beginners' Meetings for newcomers is an old A.A. tradition that goes back to the early 1940's in many parts of the United States and Canada. Glenn C. (South Bend, Indiana) IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1915. . . . . . . . . . . . RE: THE A.A. MESSAGE IN PRINT-SUMMARY OF DISTRIBUTION From: Rob Childs . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/14/2004 8:21:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy;">Do you know how to get an ascii version of the big book? Is that the computer disk or CD version? If so, how does one order a copy? 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy;"> -----Original Message----- *From:* JOHN REID [mailto:johnyr1@iprimus.com.au] *Sent:* Wednesday, July 14, 2004 3:49 AM
*To:* aaHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com *Subject:* [AAHistoryLovers] THE A.A. MESSAGE IN PRINT-SUMMARY OF DISTRIBUTION 12.0pt;"> Below are the literature piece that are updated annually. Service Material from the General Service Office THE A.A. MESSAGE IN PRINT-SUMMARY OF DISTRIBUTION First Printing through December 31, 2003 *Alcoholics Anonymous (Big Book)* English (First printing - 1939) Hardcover (B-1) 15,845,956 Softcover (B-30) 6,713,109 Large Print (B-16) 241,712 Pocket/abridged (B-35) 1,163,732 Total: 23,964,509 Spanish (First Printing - 1962) Hardcover (SB-1) 53,561 Softcover (SB-30) 495,032 Pocket/abridged (SB-35) 68,024 Total: 616,617 *Twelve
Steps and Twelve Traditions** * English (First Printing - 1952) Hardcover (B-2) 7,842,858 Pocket Size (B-17) 412,778 Softcover (B-15) 2,254,309 Large Print (B-14) 120,208 Gift Edition (B-4) 1,386,176 Total: 12,016,329 Spanish (First Printing - 1985) Softcover (SB-15) 357,325 Pocket Size (SB-17) 37,440 Total: 394,765 Other Formats Audio Cassettes: Big Book (MB-1) 79,659 Big Book (MB-1A) 490 Twelve & Twelve (MB-2) 38,937 Big Book CD ROM (M-70) 517 Big Book Audio CD (M-81) 1,235 Spanish Big Book (SMB-1) 6,839 Spanish Twelve & Twelve (SMB-2) 11,320 Braille: Big Book (M-34) 2,766 Twelve & Twelve (M-35) 1,717 ASL Video: Big Book (VS-1) 1,910 Computer Disk: Big Book (M-53) 7,234 12.0pt;"> IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1916. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: AA on the Internet From: soul . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/15/2004 6:43:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII The Online Service Conference has a nice page on AA History on the Internet Here is the link http://www.aa- onlineserviceconference.org/history_online_aa.htm#AA%20on%20the% 20Internet . soul
--- In AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com, "Gary Becktell" wrote:
> Does anyone have any info on the early days of AA on the Internet, and > the Bulletin Boards that preceded the Internet? Thank you. > G
> gk@k... IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1917. . . . . . . . . . . . 4th Edition Big Book From: chillydog012001 . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/13/2004 5:34:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII I am interested in the years and General Service Conference votes that took place in order to publish the 4th Edition of the Big Book. How many votes took place and what was the general consensus at the group level. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1918. . . . . . . . . . . . principles before personalities... From: Stanley . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/15/2004 2:04:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII I'm new to this mailing list; but certainly not new to A.A. (16 years sobriety) and I have a question that I hope someone familiar to A.A. history could help me with. I've read most of the books sanctioned by A.A.; but can't remember how the last part of the 12th Tradition came into being. The "...principles before personalities" part. I am really excited about this mailing list! Stan
********************************************************************** Stanley Koehler In the heart of the Ozarks stanley4756@mchsi.com Springfield, MO ********************************************************************** IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1919. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Re: AA on the Internet From: Mark Warner . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/15/2004 12:29:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII soul wrote: > The Online Service Conference has a nice page on AA History on the > Internet Here is the link http://www.aa- > onlineserviceconference.org/history_online_aa.htm#AA%20on%20the% > 20Internet . http://www.aa-onlineserviceconference.org/history_online_aa.htm#AA%20on%20the% 20\ Internet [85] http://tinyurl.com/3qk69 -- Mark Warner IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1920. . . . . . . . . . . . Report from the Moderator From: NMOlson@aol.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/16/2004 2:37:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Friends, A few items: 1. As of tomorrow, July 17, I will be out of town for a few days and the AA history lovers will be inactive. I will be at Shreveport, LA for a talk to the Louisiana Association of Substance Abuse Counselors and Trainers, Inc. If any members of the list will be present I would be delighted to meet you. 2. I have been doing a post every month of significant dates in AA history. I have been unwell for the last several week and have not had the energy to finish the July list. Is anyone willing to take this over for me? As my sources I use the 2004 Sobriety Calendar PLUS this website: Sobriety Anniversaries [86] BTW, July 21, 1980, Marry Mann suffered her fatal stroke. She died the next day. I sorely miss her. 3. I may also have to turn the AA history list over to someone else in the near future -- at least temporarily. At least temporarily. I warn that it is very time consuming so a single, retired person might be the ideal. 4. As of today there are 901 members of the list. Each day it seems to advance by one or two members, then suddenly ten members will disappear. The mysteries of the Internet. I think it has something to do with "bouncing," whatever the devil that means. If anyone can explain it, this ol' gal would be appreciative. I hope you are all having a good summer and that I will meet some of you in Louisiana over the next few days. Fondly,
Nancy Olson Moderator IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1921. . . . . . . . . . . . Principles before personalities From: marathonmanric . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/16/2004 8:57:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Hello AAHistory Lovers, My understanding of that phrase in the 12th tradition (...ever reminding us to place principles before personalities.) has always been the realization that there are no expert personalities or occupations in AA. No Doctors or clergy which many have a "hand up" on the recovery process. If you are a member of Alcoholics Anonymous and, in turn, have a desire to stop and stay stopped drinking, you are also just another recovering alcoholic, and we all learn from each other. We learn the same principles and our recovery is not based on any type of personality. Ric the GratefulCamel in Miami IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1922. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: principles before personalities... From: Arthur Sheehan . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/16/2004 10:58:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Hi Stanley and welcome on board. What follows is a bit of long answer to your short question. A useful place to get a sense of the context of the Traditions is their long form. Tradition 12's long form is: And finally, we of Alcoholics Anonymous believe that the principle of Anonymity has an immense spiritual significance. It reminds us that we are to place principles before personalities; that we are actually to practice a genuine humility. This to the end that our great blessings may never spoil us; that we shall forever live in thankful contemplation of Him who presides over us all. Below is a timeline of some milestones in the evolution of the Traditions. SOURCE REFERENCES: AACOA - AA Comes of Age, AAWS GTBT - Grateful to Have Been There by Nell Wing (soft cover) LOH - The Language of the Heart, AA Grapevine Inc PIO - Pass It On, AAWS SM - AA Service Manual and Twelve Concepts for World Service, AAWS 1942 Correspondence from groups gave early signals of a need to develop guidelines to help with group problems that occurred repeatedly. The basic ideas for the Twelve Traditions emerged from this correspondence and the principles defined in the Foreword to the first Ed. of the Big Book. (AACOA 187, 192-193, 198, 204, PIO 305-306, LOH 154) 1945 April, Earl Treat, founder of AA in Chicago (Big Book Story: He Sold Himself Short) suggested to Bill W that he codify the Traditions and write essays on them in the Grapevine. (AACOA 22, 203, GTBT 54-55, 77, SM S8, PIO 306, LOH 20-24) August, the Grapevine carried Bill W's first article (Modesty One Plank for Good Public Relations) and set the groundwork for Bill's 5-year campaign for the Traditions. The July Grapevine edition had an article by member CHK of Lansing, MI about the Washingtonians. Bill used this article to begin his essay commentaries. 1946 April, the Grapevine carried Bill W's article Twelve Suggested Points for AA Tradition. They would later be called the long form of the Twelve Traditions. (AACOA viii, 96, 203, LOH 20, 154) 1949 As plans for the first Int'l Convention were under way, Earl T suggested to Bill W that the Twelve Suggested Points for AA Tradition would benefit from revision and shortening. (AACOA 213 says it occurred in 1947) Bill, with Earl's help, set out to develop the short form of the Twelve Traditions. (AACOA 213, GTBT 55, 77, PIO 334) November, the short form of the Twelve Traditions was first printed in the AA Grapevine. The entire issue was dedicated to the Traditions in preparation for the forthcoming Cleveland Convention. Two wording changes were subsequently made to the initial version: "primary spiritual aim" was changed to "primary purpose" in Tradition Six, and "principles above personalities" was changed to "principles before personalities" in Tradition Twelve. (LOH 96 and copy of Nov 1949 Grapevine) 1950
Jul 28-30, AA's 15th anniversary and first International Convention at Cleveland, OH. An estimated 3,000 attendees adopted the Twelve Traditions unanimously. (AACOA 43, LOH 121, PIO 338) ----- Original Message ----- From: Stanley To: A.A. History Sent: Thursday, July 15, 2004 2:04 PM Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] principles before personalities... I'm new to this mailing list; but certainly not new to A.A. (16 years sobriety) and I have a question that I hope someone familiar to A.A. history could help me with. I've read most of the books sanctioned by A.A.; but can't remember how the last part of the 12th Tradition came into being. The "...principles before personalities" part. I am really excited about this mailing list! Stan ********************************************************************** Stanley Koehler In the heart of the Ozarks stanley4756@mchsi.com Springfield, MO ********************************************************************** IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1923. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Principles before personalities From: Danny S . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/16/2004 2:39:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII In Tradition 12, is about "anonymity". In the long form, "principal before personalities" is in reference back to the word "anonymity". It describes a reminder which anonymity gives us. The other reminder born out of anonymity is humility. The subject of "nonprofessional" versus "professional" is addressed in Tradition 8, not 12. Hope this is helpful Peace, Danny S
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1924. . . . . . . . . . . . Dr. Bob''s Tattoos From: Roger Dowdy . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/19/2004 12:47:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII I'm looking for additional information regarding Dr. Bob's tattoos (i.e. location, where he got them, etc.). Here's all I've been able to find thus far (thanks to Silkworth.net): A tattoo he wore the rest of his life was probably from those days at Dartmouth: a dragon and a compass tattoo. The dragon wound around his left arm from the shoulder to the wrist. It was blue with red fire. His son thinks "he had to have been drunk to have it put there, and you didn't do something that complicated in a day. When I asked him how he got it, he said, 'Boy, that was a dandy!' And it must have been, too." Many thanks, in advance! -Roger IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 1925. . . . . . . . . . . . The Upper Room and its influence on early A.A. From: Glenn Chesnut . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/20/2004 12:28:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII After some years of searching, I have just found some copies of The Upper Room from 1938 and 1939. This was the meditational book which most A.A. people used to read every morning during the early period (1935-1948). Reading through them proved to be even more insightful than I had dreamed. You can get a real feel for the simple but incredibly deep Christian piety of Anne Smith, and you find meditation after meditation where it almost seems as through you are sitting in a very good modern A.A. meeting. I have made some excerpts of typical readings which illustrate the kind of influence which The Upper Room had on early A.A. In order to format it in a way that will be readable, I have had to organize it in a way that cannot be set up in an e-mail. So I apologize for having to do it this way, but you will be able to read these passages by clicking here: http://hindsfoot.org/UpRm1.html (it is also listed if you click on "A.A. Historical Materials" over on the left hand side in the general Hindsfoot Download 4.17 Mb. Share with your friends:
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