Aa history Lovers 2006 moderators Nancy Olson and Glenn F. Chesnut page
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South Bend, Indiana IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 3446. . . . . . . . . . . . Rockefeller dinner pamphlet From: Charlie C . . . . . . . . . . . . 5/25/2006 7:02:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Hi folks, in reading once again AA Comes of Age about the Rockefeller dinner I was struck by the mention in there of the fact that transcripts were made of the talks given at the dinner, and put into a pamphlet by Rockefeller. I looked in the group message archives but didn't see anything about this - may have missed it of course! So my question is, would the text of those talks or the pamphlet be available anywhere? Thanks, this is a wonderfully informative group!
From: khemex@comcast.net . . . . . . . . . . . . 5/22/2006 8:00:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII It appears four times in Twenty Four Hours a Day (March 21, July 16, March 29, and March 17) ______________________________
(khemex at comcast.net) The quote you're looking for, I believe can be found in the Twenty Four Hours a Day book in the "Thought for the day" section of March 21st.
Gerry W
------------------------------ March 21
"All is fundamentally well. That does not mean that all is well on the surface of things. But it does mean that God's in His heaven and that He has a purpose for the world, which will eventually work out when enough human beings are willing to follow His way. 'Wearing the world like a loose garment' means not being upset by the surface wrongness of things, but feeling deeply secure in the fundamental goodness and purpose in the universe." ______________________________
(rowek at softcom.net) "Wear the world like a loose garment" ------------------------------ 24 Hours a Day, July 16: "We can believe that God is in His heaven and that He has a purpose for our lives, which will eventually work out as long as we try to live the way we believe He wants us to live. It has been said that we should 'wear the world like a loose garment.' That means that nothing should seriously upset us because we have a deep, abiding faith that God will always take care of us. To us that means not to be too upset by the surface wrongness of things, but to feel deeply secure in the fundamental goodness and purpose in the universe. Do I feel deeply secure? ______________________________
(sobermuse123 at aol.com) In the 24 Hour a Day Book, for March 29th, there is a reference to "wearing the world as a loose garment." Jeanne M. dos 1-23-81 Concord, NH ------------------------------ March 29 "I must live in the world and yet live apart from God. I can go forth from my secret times of communion with God to the work of the world. The get the spiritual strength I need, my inner life must be lived apart from the world. I must wear the world as a loose garment. Nothing in the world should seriously upset me, as long as my inner life is lived with God. All successful living arises from this inner life." ______________________________
(jwm_az at yahoo.com) The quote is on the page for March 17, in TWENTY-FOUR HOURS A DAY (the "little black book"), in the little Prayer for the Day at the bottom of the page:
I pray that I might keep serene at the center of my being." Cheers, James M.
4/1/1987 ______________________________ See http://seniorark.com/senior_links_spiritual.htm which also attributes it to Richmond Walker and Twenty Four Hours a Day. ______________________________ RICHMOND WALKER, AUTHOR OF TWENTY FOUR HOURS A DAY (born Aug. 2, 1892, died on Mar. 25, 1965 with 22 years of sobriety, honored all through Florida AA as one of their greatest figures) From the moderator, Glenn C. Twenty-Four Hours a Day was the second most important book in early A.A., second only to the Big Book in importance. There were periods when more members had a copy of the Twenty Four Hour book than had a copy of the Big Book. This is an important part of AA's Historic Heritage. Most AA people from the 1950's and 60's will tell you that they got sober on two books: the Big Book and the Twenty Four Hour book, both of which they read continually. Twenty-Four Hours a Day was written by AA member Richmond Walker, the second most published AA author (the "big four" early AA authors were Bill Wilson, Richmond Walker, Ed Webster, and Father Ralph Pfau). Richmond Walker got sober in Boston in May 1942, shortly after the first AA group was started there. He eventually ended up in Daytona Beach, Florida, and originally wrote these meditations on small cards, for his own personal use.
the meditations in book form, so they could use them to. The group did that in 1948, using the printing press in the county courthouse, and Rich distributed them from the basement of his home, taking any profit from their sale and contributing it to the New York AA office.
by AA people all over the country, and soon replaced The Upper Room as the standard AA meditational book. The traditional understanding in old time AA was that any book or pamphlet sponsored by one AA group could automatically be used by any other AA group which wished to do so.
the New York AA office in 1953 if they would take over printing and distributing the books. The New York AA office was at is wit's end in 1952 to 1953, trying to find money to publish Bill Wilson's Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions, and could see no way they could take on trying to find the money to publish and distribute a second new book. Ed Webster was simultaneously offering the New York AA office The Little Red Book, but New York turned his offer down for the same reason. Patrick Butler at the Hazelden Foundation, which was just a big farmhouse on a Minnesota farm at that time, with a small live-in treatment program for alcoholics, told Rich in 1954 it would take over printing and distributing his book, to make sure that AA people still had access to it. This was the beginning of what was eventually to become the giant Hazelden publishing business, but that was only much later, after the psychiatrically oriented people took over control of Hazelden, which had originally been run by just a handful of AA members.
of Hazelden, which was in Minnesota. Rich lived in Florida and continued to keep up contacts with Boston and New England, but was not involved with AA in the upper midwest.
http://hindsfoot.org/RWfla1.html http://hindsfoot.org/RWfla2.html http://hindsfoot.org/RWfla3.html Photos at http://hindsfoot.org/rwpix1.html
****************************** IN THE AA GRAPEVINE: From: "Kimball" (rowek at softcom.net)
Using It", by Terry B. "I was feeling rather depressed and called my sponsor and found her in a similar mood. I said, "What shall I do?" At first she said, "I don't know. If you figure it out call me back." Then because she is a loving person, a good friend, and has a terrific grasp of the AA program, she shifted into sponsorship gear and told me to do the following: Wear life like a loose garment. Don't take myself so seriously. Count my blessings. Find another alcoholic to work with. Read the Big Book and go to a meeting." ****************************** ****************************** ORIGINALLY FROM ST. FRANCIS ??? From: ny-aa@att.net (ny-aa@att.net)
garment," is somewhere in the "Twenty-Four Hours a Day" book.
writer, Richmond W, may have gotten it from St Francis.
"The one who is dead to self will certainly not even notice some things that others would - for example, things such as social slights, verbal put-downs and innuendos, or physical discomforts. But many other rebuffs to 'the dear self,' as the philosopher Immanuel Kant called it, will be noticed still, often quite clearly. However, if we are dead to self to any significant degree, these rebuffs will not take control of us, not even to the point of disturbing our feelings or peace of mind. We will, as St. Francis of Assisi said, 'wear the world like a loose garment, which touches us in a few places and there lightly.'" ______________________________
(tmisteli@yahoo.com) Jon: It purportedly comes from St. Francis of Assisi; the full quote attributed to him is, "Wear the world like a loose garment, which touches us in a few places and there lightly." ILandS, Tom Misteli Dallas TX 11/29/87
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does not show up anywhere that I could find in "God Calling by Two Listeners," but there is no complete concordance to that book, so I could have missed it.
one of the major Oxford Group works, was used as a source by Richmond Walker for many of the passages in the fine print sections of his meditations. "God Calling" is still one of the five or six most popular books sold at Christian bookstores, so if anyone could find the quotation there, that would explain not only where Richmond Walker got it from, but the source of many of the other uses of that quotation which one can find on the internet. ****************************** ****************************** SOME THOUGHT IT ORIGINALLY CAME FROM THE BIBLE: From: "John S." (quasso@mindspring.com) I believe that like so many of our sayings and slogans it is an adaptation of the Biblical admonition to "Wear the world like a loose garment" .... I believe that the biblical admonition was to illustrate that folks shouldn't attach themselves to material things too much but rather to put their faith and trust in a Higher Power (Whom I choose to call God). Service is Love, John S.
______________________________ From: Lance Weldgen (lance_1954 at yahoo.com) "Wear the world as a loose garment" is a quote from the Bible. HUGS!!! Lance from colorful Colorado! ______________________________ From the moderator, Glenn C. I used the Bible concordance at http://www.searchgodsword.org/ which is an extremely useful research tool, and could not find any references under either "loose" or "garment" that appeared to match this quotation, in any of the Bible translations that I checked. John S. and Lance W., if it is from the Bible, can you tell us where in the Bible? I can't find it, if it is.
****************************** From the moderator, Glenn C. If you do a Google search for the phrase "like a loose garment," you will quickly discover that it has been used by literally hundreds of different people.
catchy gospel tune by the notorious Father Divine (who claimed to be God, among other things).
that quote, which he clearly loved so much, from that source (grin)!
from Rich's book, where the many early AA people who read that every morning ran into it four times a year. The ultimate source of the quote is still up for grabs, although St. Francis has been suggested.
WHERE in St. Francis' writings? Remembering that the so-called St. Francis Prayer was not in fact written by St. Francis, but was written by a modern spiritual writer on a little card with a picture of St. Francis on the other side. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 3448. . . . . . . . . . . . RE: AA medallions for anniversaries From: ArtSheehan . . . . . . . . . . . . 5/26/2006 7:15:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII I believe engraved Zippo lighters were one of, if not, the earliest mementos given out on sobriety anniversaries - particularly the first annual milestone. They were relatively inexpensive, widely available, and in those days just about everyone sobering up smoked. Also Sister Ignatia had a sacred heart of Jesus patch she gave out to alcoholic patients discharged from St Thomas Hospital. I believe it was cloth material of some sort.
matters. Anything that had inherent personal appeal was quickly copied.
Arthur
++++Message 3449. . . . . . . . . . . . 12 Steps From: puggreen2008 . . . . . . . . . . . . 5/25/2006 7:54:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Greetings all, I heard someone sharing on the history of the steps the other night and they mentioned a book called 'In The Beginning' and this book contains the steps ( 50 of them ) from which 12 were chosen. Is there any truth in this? Best wishes Des _____________________________________ Note from the moderator: the two best places to look up old books are: http://dogbert.abebooks.com/ http://www.alibris.com/ These are catalogs maintained by the professional dealers in rare and used books. You can find AA books in these two lists also, and can check to see what the going rate is for such-and-such a printing of such-and-such an edition of a particular book, if you just want to see how rare your old book actually is.
idea as to the contents of the books, and there were an awful lot of books with "In the Beginning" as part of the title. Glenn Chesnut South Bend, Indiana IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 3451. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: stepping stones From: and25g . . . . . . . . . . . . 5/22/2006 2:44:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII I just came back from the visit to Stepping Stones. I was told by the person who met me there (his name is Ken B) that Bill and Louis had their furniture in storage after they lost their Clinton st. house and it was moved to the Stepping Stones. They do claim that the kitchen table is the original table where Ebby and Bill met. It looks like Ken B. spends much time at the Stepping Stones and is happy to answer any questions visitors have. I have his e-mail and will invite him to join the group.
Andrey
MY E-MAIL ADDRESS IS (and25g at yahoo.com) --- In AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com, "Mitchell K." > > > Just a couple of points.... > > When I visited with Lois about 3 months before she > passed on there were no glasses in the kitchen just as > there were no glasses in the kitchen when I visited > there soon after she passed on. > > Maybe I'm losing my memory (I do know my short-term is > severely damaged) but can someone refresh it about > Bill and Marty starting what was to become the National > Council in the livingroom > > As far as "THE" table.... it has been reported that > there are a few "THE" tables where Bill and Ebby met. > > As far as the desk in the study on the hill being > "THE" desk where the Big Book was written... I've sat > at that desk many a time and it wouldn't fit in the > office in the Newark office and I someone will have to > fill me in if BandL stored the Clinton St. furniture or > took it with them on all their moves. > > Another thing.... it cannot be classified as "It is > the most important collection of AA artifacts > > and history anywhere." > > I'm tickled pink that you enjoyed yourself so much at > Stepping Stones. I wish more members of the Fellowship > would have your interest in our history. However... we > must temper historical fact with legend. Hey, I may be > totally off base... > >
> > I just got back from a visit to Stepping Stones in > > Bedford Falls NY (just above NYC) where Bill and > > Lois lived from 1941 on. > > It is well worth a visit from anyone even slightly > > interested in AA history. > >
> > They have done a marvelous job of keeping it in > > exactly the same condition it was when Bill and lois > > lived there (Lois' glasses are where she left them > > in the kitchen). > > > > What a treasure trove of history! > > > > You can sit at the kitchen table that Ebby and Bill > > sat at in Clinton street when Bill pushed a drink > > over to him and Ebby announced " I got religion". > > You can stand in the living room where Marty Mann > > and Bill formed Council that would become the > > National Council on Alcoholism and Drug Dependence . > > You can sit at the desk where Bill wrote the Big > > Book and the 12 and 12. > > You can see the map filled with stick pins where > > Bill measured the progress of new groups across the > > country. > > You can sit and gaze out the window that he looked > > out when contemplating how he would respond to the > > hundreds of questions > > coming in from all over the country about how to > > start a meeting etc. > >
> > The best part - its largely undiscovered by the > > masses. You can get a quiet visit with a volunteer > > tour guide and take your time to savor each part. > >
> > It is the most important collection of AA artifacts > > and history anywhere. > > > > I have been to East Dorset (birthplace, childhood > > home, gravesite) > > I have been to Akron. (Dr Bob's house, Mayflower > > Hotel) > > Bedford Falls is the Mother Lode. > > > > www.steppingstones.org > > > > they are having a big picnic on June 3 if you like a > > crowd, > > but I recommend you go when its quiet and no one > > else is there. > >
> > Rob White > > Baltimore > > 410 328 8549 > >
> > > >
> > > >
> IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 3452. . . . . . . . . . . . Which takes precedence, Long or Short Traditions? From: yankee1gb . . . . . . . . . . . . 5/24/2006 5:11:00 AM
provides a more detailed or precise statement than its short form counterpart. The Short form traditions were, however, published/adopted more recently in time and are about the only form commonly mentioned.
Short Traditions? From: t . . . . . . . . . . . . 5/27/2006 12:52:00 AM
> The long form of the traditions were published/adopted first and each > provides a more detailed or precise statement than its short form > counterpart. The Short form traditions were, however, > published/adopted more recently in time and are about the only form > commonly mentioned. > > Does either form take precedent over the other? > > Short answer: whichever best applies to a particular situation... what ever yields the best
results. While keeping in mind as many of the Traditions [which ever form] and Steps. Long answer: First we need to separate published vs. adopted. The Long Form of the Traditions were first published, in the Grapevine, April
1946, as "Twelve Suggested Points of AA Tradition", a sort of first draft form some say.
Then again in the Grapevine, October 1947, "Traditions Stressed in Memphis Talk" in a more finished form recognizable to our membership today. In Pass It On [PIO] pg 324, it states that Bill spent 1947-1950 out in the groups
trying, rather unsuccessfully, to "sell" these Long Form Traditions. Sometime in late 1949 it was suggested to Bill by Earl T of Chicago that they
needed to be edited down, so Bill [with the help of a few trusted members] did just that. [PIO pg 334] Download 13.83 Mb. Share with your friends:
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