Aa history Lovers 2006 moderators Nancy Olson and Glenn F. Chesnut page

idea and threatened, unsuccessfully, to secede. He criticized Bill and

the 'New York office' vitriolically at every opportunity. Bill

steadfastly refused to hold a grudge against him and in their

correspondence 'used soft words to turn away wrath.'
Much later, when they met at the International Convention in Toronto,

they actually spent several hours together, reminiscing. However,

Clarence, a popular speaker on the Steps and the recovery program,

continued to raise hackles wherever he appeared by calling press

conferences in which he was photographed full face with his full name,

holding the Big Book which he claimed he wrote, and identifying

himself as the founder of Alcoholics Anonymous. He asserted he was not

bound by AA's Traditions because they were written later - and written

by Bill. Clarence S moved to Florida in retirement, where he remained

extremely active until his death in 1984."

matters, beyond that expressed in AA Comes of Age namely, so that 'the

basic facts of AA's growth and development never can become

distorted.' By 1955, the facts were already being distorted by

Clarence S and other oldtimers who were attempting to undermine Bill's

place in AA's history. So Bill wanted the records available. Also Bill

was visionary; he saw the sweep and scope of the Fellowship he had

helped found and foresaw its significance as a social movement to be

studied by future historians."
Bob P also write:
"The choices quickly boiled down to 'The Way Out,' favored by most in

Akron, and 'Alcoholics Anonymous,' favored by most in New York. Bill

asked Fitz M, who lived near Washington, DC, to check both titles

through the library of congress. Fitz wired back to the effect that

the Library of Congress had 25 books entitled 'The Way Out,' 12

entitled 'The Way,' and none called 'Alcoholics Anonymous.' That

settled the matter. The title of the book quickly became the name of

the Fellowship as well. Clarence S later called himself the founder of

Alcoholics Anonymous, basing his claim on his being the first to use

the name for a group. Which he probably was. But the fact is, the book

Alcoholics Anonymous was already off the press, and the name had been

used a year earlier to refer to the Fellowship as a whole."

occurred

April-June and cited in "Not God") in which Bill W informed Dr Bob

that he had dictated and mimeographed two chapters of the proposed

book. Bill stated that he felt that "the completed book should

represent the works of many people; particularly the individual

stories." Bill W wrote "My feeling is that Anne should do the one

portraying the wife of an alcoholic." Later in the long letter Bill

wrote "By the way, you might all be thinking up a good title. Nearly

everyone agrees that we should sign the volume "Alcoholics

Anonymous."

Titles such as Haven, One Hundred Men, Comes the Dawn, etc. have been

suggested." Bill also asked Dr Bob "What would you think about the

formation of a charitable corporation to be called, let us say,

"Alcoholics Anonymous?" (re GSO Archives letter "Alco.

Fd." R-28 Bx

59, Not God pgs 74-75, 333).

"Alcoholics Anonymous." (re Lois Remembers pg 197)

to

the Fellowship as "Alcoholics Anonymous" prior to publication of

Big Book. It contained the following excerpts which have been joined

together and are separated by ellipses:
"Many alcoholics are men of exceptional character and will power, as

proven by the type of men that make up Alcoholics Anonymous ."

"The

first step has been the establishment of a trust known as The

well-known business men who are non-alcoholics and by two members of

Alcoholics Anonymous.." "The publishing of this book, to be known

as

"One Hundred Men" is the subject of the attached material ."

chapters have now been written)". "It is an indisputable fact that

over the past four years over one-hundred true alcoholics have

recovered, who from the standpoint of medicine and psychiatry, were

considered hopeless. These men have dubbed themselves Alcoholics

Anonymous ..." "The name Alcoholics Anonymous has been adopted

because

of the nature of the work, because of the desire to keep away from

59)
Contrary to your email message, the above documentation serves to

shape the impression I have of Clarence S and it is substantiated by

many independent and unambiguous sources. It is a result of study and

correlation of evidence - not "resentments, being closed minded and

misquoting." Your message might suggest a case of "physician heal

thyself."
Cheers

Arthur
-----Original Message-----

From: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com

[mailto:AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Mitchell K.

Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2006 6:55 PM

To: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com

Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] Clarence did not write program for 1st

Internat'l Conf.

misquoting.

program for that event. The Stanley brothers were

pretty much in charge. Art says "This was all part of

Clarence Snyder's claim..." Again Art - CLARENCE HAD

NOTHING TO DO WITH THE WRITING OF THE PROGRAM - THE

FINAL COPY, THE DRAFT COPY OR THE TENTATIVE COPY!

was the first to use the TERM Alcoholics Anonymous to

describe itself. There is NO evidence or documentation

(maybe there is now, like the so-called loaner stamp

on the multilith which was never there before) showing

where gatherings of members of the Fellowship called

these meetings Alcoholics Anonymous meetings. Clarence

called the meeting itself an Alcoholics Anonymous

meeting after the book of the same name - he wasn't

referring to the Fellowship or the book or the

foundation but specifically the MEETING. NOWHERE in

the archives (unless it was recently manufactured) is

there a reference to holding an Alcoholics Anonymous

meeting where a bunch of members met to share their

experience, strength and hope.
There is also NO evidence showing that Alcoholics

Anonymous was ever called AA prior to Clarence using

that term. Nell Wing said that Clarence was the first

to use the initials AA as a description of Alcoholics

Anonymous. Ergo...Clarence was the founder of AA (not

Alcoholics Anonymous but the term AA).

restrictions on reprinting?

From: ricktompkins . . . . . . . . . . . . 9/17/2006 1:18:00 PM
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Pulling permission to reprint anything from whom?

The sourcing protocol for AAWS has not changed from what's in the AA

Service Manual and no 2006 decisions by the AA General Service Board have

added any new restrictions. The objections from members of the Fellowship

would be immediate, because such decisions bypass the General Service

Conference without an expressed emergency need.

To generally describe reprint policy, AAWS has a very loose permission

agreement for AA members and AA Groups where a simple excerpt needs the

source and the phrase "used with permission of AAWS, Inc."

Traditions Four

and Six still apply.

Longer and complete tracks, let's say an entire chapter of Experience,

Strength, and Hope or one from the AA Grapevine's Language of the Heart

would need a written request for approval from the Boards of the relevant

publishing houses (AAWS or Gv). If the reprinting is definitely an intra-AA

venture that has no connection to outside enterprise, permission would most

likely be granted. I believe that hidden agendas or non-altruistic motives

would be seen as reason for reprint denial.

AAWS Archives Workbook for review by the 2001 National Archives Workshop

attendees was requested but didn't need a formal approval from the General

Service Board. In fact, GSO administration staff gave permission over the

telephone while mailed letters went back and forth on the activity. Even a

Researcher's Card goes before the Trustees Archives Committee if it's

necessary to establish the intent of the research activity at GSO's AA

Archives, and this has been policy for decades. Nothing has changed to my

knowledge.

To re-publish an AAWS work for a larger distribution from an 'ouside-AA'

publishing entity is something different. Does "IWS" or the

"Anonymous

Press" come to mind? For another hypothetical example in the copyright

world, Penguin Books would be in legal trouble if it published Mitchell's

own How It Worked biography without contact first. The copyrights for AAWS

and Gv are in effect, and the 'used with pernission' as footnotes to

excerpts acknowledges those copyrights.

From AAWS or Gv, some reprint activity needs a formal permission request

but most don't!

Rick T., Illinois

From: Glenn Chesnut . . . . . . . . . . . . 9/18/2006 12:28:00 AM

as though one can copy almost nothing from a work on

which someone else has claimed a copyright. But this

is not correct. There are all sorts of different kinds

of copying which are regarded as "fair use." (This

is the technical legal term.)

Those who are concerned should look at the following

three discussions of the legal concept of "fair use"

of copyrighted materials:

balanced against one another:

market for the original or for permissions

if the use were widespread?
In the case of the first factor: nonprofit, educational,

or purely personal use tips the balance towards fair use.

Commercial use tips the balance the other direction, that

is, makes it more likely that it would be regarded as a

copyright violation.
In the case of the second factor: copying facts, and

(interestingly enough) things that are already published,

tips the balance towards fair use. Copying from something

that someone else has not yet published tips the balance

the other direction.
Third factor: the more of the work you copy, the less

likely it is to be regarded as fair use.

if the original is out of print or otherwise unavailable,

or if the copyright owner is unidentifiable. It is tipped

the other way if the copy will be published in a way

that will take sales away from the original.
What makes it difficult to figure out what is fair use,

is that there are four different balance factors at work,

and each of them affects the overall balance.
So photocopying an entire library book looks bad in

terms of Factor 3, because it is the entire book. But

as long as it is only for your own personal use, this

tips Factor 1 so far in the direction of fair use, that

this is regularly regarded as fair use in actual practice.

This is why most American libraries have photocopiers in

them nowadays, because this kind of use is generally

regarded as fair use in actual practice. The important

thing is, you can only copy things on the photocopier in

the library for your own personal use. You cannot sell

these copies to other people.
As a college professor, I would make two or three

photocopies of selections from one or more of the books

in the library, which were going to be required reading

for one of my courses, and then put these on reserve,

for the students to check out and read. The university

librarians and university lawyers said that this was

fair use.
On the other hand, I could not make a copy for each

student in my course and charge the students the price

of the photocopying, because that tipped Factor 4 over

towards a commercial transaction. A famous court case

back in the 1980's against a major national photocopying

chain cost them a lot of money when the judge ruled

that this practice (in which they had been deeply

involved) was copyright infringement.

of print book to keep on their shelves, this would

probably be regarded as fair use, looking at the

four factors.

to decide. A copyright lawyer might well say to you,

"On a scale of 1 to 10, I would call that a 7. You can

probably do it, and a judge would probably approve it

if it went to court. But that would not be a sure thing

that you could count on one hundred percent."

sometimes people (usually at the lower level) in the

New York GSO who do not really know anything much

about American copyright law. They can sometimes become

over zealous, and believe that they are "following the

strict letter of the law" in telling people they

cannot copy something, or that they have to obtain

permission to copy something, when in fact many years

of appellate cases have established that what they

are objecting to is considered "fair use" by every

judge in the United States.
But lawsuits are expensive, and copyright law is

slippery and ambiguous enough that copying something

that is even a 7 or 8 on a "fair use" scale of

1 to 10, might not be worth the legal risk.

From: George Cleveland . . . . . . . . . . . . 9/19/2006 11:07:00 PM

Ann R., Alcoholic

By MAURA J. CASEY

Published: September 16, 2006
Former Gov. Ann Richards of Texas will be remembered for her wit, her

one-liners and especially for the keynote speech at the 1988

Democratic Convention, which was, in retrospect, the high point in the

party's dismal campaign for the presidency that year. To intrigued

television viewers nationwide, Ms. Richards, with her big hair and big

attitude, epitomized the kind of formidable woman that is a hallmark

of the Lone Star State. People liked her down-home phrases. When she

said, "We're gonna tell how the cow ate the cabbage," they

believed

her. She leavened a plain-spoken manner with wisecracks. Both helped

elect her governor two years later.
But her political career eclipsed what Ms. Richards called "one of the

great, great stories" of her life: her recovery from alcoholism and

her nearly 26 years of sobriety. That triumph deserves to be more than

a line in her obituary.

rehabilitation program in 1980, after a painful intervention by family

and friends, was necessary for her continued rise in public life. What

made Ms. Richards different was her decision to be forthright about

the fact that she was a recovering alcoholic. She didn't hide it. "I

like to tell people that alcoholism is one of my strengths," she said.

She was right. Alcoholics know that seeds of healthy recovery grow

from the need to mend their own flaws to stay sober, one day at a

time. Ms. Richards faced her imperfections fearlessly, and that

enabled others to be fearless, too, if only for a little while.

mail she received after enrolling in a rehabilitation program was an

encouraging letter from Ms. Richards. A politician who left rehab and

wondered how on earth he was going to avoid drinking when he got home

well after midnight found Ms. Richards waiting for him when he

arrived. As governor, she started treatment programs in Texas prisons.

When she visited, she would tell the inmates the simple truth: "My

name's Ann, and I'm an alcoholic." Her imperfection had become a

source of inspiration for others.
Ann Richards was funny, wise and compassionate. At 73, she died too

soon. But she died sober.

From: John Wikelius . . . . . . . . . . . . 9/19/2006 11:41:00 PM

need Harper date

converted date

does anyone know how many of each Harper was printed?

groups/meetings begin?

From: Ernest Kurtz . . . . . . . . . . . . 9/20/2006 8:25:00 AM
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Hi,
I am trying to trace the history of online AA,

AA online. Individual members no doubt communicated

with other members as one way of enhancing their

sobriety long before the web, perhaps even in the

early days of ARPA-NET.
But does anyone have any idea when and where and

how the first self-conscious "group" or "meeting"

began . . . maybe in "bulletin-board" days?

Please, I will appreciate any help on this, via

AAHL or directly, if you prefer.
Thanks.
ernie kurtz

(kurtzern at umich.edu)

From: Danny S . . . . . . . . . . . . 9/19/2006 7:59:00 PM

world population is alcoholic - usually qualified with the inclusion

of "estimated" and "professionals".
Does anyone know from where these estimates originate and who

the "professionals" are who did the estimating? I am looking to

validate this statement.
Thanks.
Peace,
Danny Schwarzhoff
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++++Message 3718. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Brown Visit 2005

From: jlobdell54 . . . . . . . . . . . . 9/19/2006 10:32:00 AM

right at (I think) the next street, there is (or used to be) five-hour

parking (I can't recall the names of the streets). I can assure you

the pencil-and-pad restriction applies to all researchers (or did when

my wife and I were last there). The collections at Brown include the

Kirk Collection (put together by Charlie Bishop), the Dr. Bob papers,

Clarence papers (put together by Mitch K.), Marty Mann NCA (NCADD)

Papers which include material from Yev Gardiner, the Ernie Kurtz

papers gathered both before and after he wrote Not-God, and a whole

lot of temperance stuff. Tovah is Librarian for the whole Kirk/CAAS

[Center for Alcohol and Addiction Studies] and other connected

Collections. I believe Brown subscribes to the same anonymity

restrictions with regard to their collections as GSO does with regard

to theirs (barring the Clarence collection where his own views on

anonymity may take preference and of course the Marty Mann NCADD

collection, which does not involve her work with AA). The Kirk online

location is

www.brown.edu/Facilities/University_Library/libs/hay/collections/

kirk/index.html
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++++Message 3719. . . . . . . . . . . . AA now started in India''s seventh

largest city

From: robin_foote . . . . . . . . . . . . 9/18/2006 2:36:00 AM
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[AA celebrates its first year in Ahmedabad, the seventh

largest city in India. Ahmedabad, with a population of

more than 5.2 million, is over on the western side of

India in Gujarat, about seventy miles from the seacoast,

up near the border with Pakistan. Moderator's note.]
Ahmedabad, September 17 (Express India News Service)
An year off bubbly, Alcoholics

Anonymous drinks to its health

the Ahmedabad chapter of Alcoholics Anonymous (AA)

is celebrating.
AA, a voluntary group that helps alcoholics overcome

their addiction, completed one year this month and the

chapter held a meeting on Sunday to share their

experiences of the past year. It's ironical that the

group is thriving in what is known to be ''the driest

State of them all.''

strengths and hopes with one another, started with a